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Zayd Julius's avatar

There's a rule in the fanfic community - waddling through 90% of the trash is worth it to find the 10% of treasure. And while I do agree with your points for the MOST part, I would push back and say that there is a heavy negative bias bleeding though. I grew up and then grew out of reading fanfiction - but at the same time, I grew up also reading Milton and Dante and Blackmore and Wolfe, lost in the stories of Wilber Smith and the voice of Homer. To this day, I still read specific fanfic authors simply because they knew what they were doing on a character and world and story.

By and large, fanfiction is bad - but calling it the source of all literary decline is a bit of a stretch - and relieves the publication and writing industry of its own faults and weights in the argument.

It's reductive, I mean - in the sense that there are a multitude of points on the timeline where we can point to and call it the start of the decline. Hemingway and his influence, Gordon Lish's influence on the modern editing process, the codification of the Workshop style, and the degradation and misinformation of modern MFA reading techniques. The loss of proper linguistical and etymological knowledge as foundational to writer knowledge, the proper ability to read, the normalization of methodical and slow reading, verbal reading, self critique. I think it's indicative that if people THINK projecting fanfiction ideas and ideals onto other mediums - then there is a broader issue at play. I hate Wattpad, personally, and I found most of the stuff on AO3 to be utter garbage, but I also understand that most of it is self indulgent on purpose.

I think fanfiction is something that is actually healthy - alongside other fringe mediums emerging like Web serials, web novels, Manhwa and Manhua - because unlike publishing, with its own content moderation, and PR concerns, they allow for DIFFERENT story ideas to emerge. Parahumans, Omniscient Reader's Viewpoint, SSS-Class Revival Hunter - these are all excellent pieces in their own right, in both their web novel format and, for the latter twos, comic form. Ciaphas Cain: Warmaster of Chaos, The Weaving Force, Not This Time Fate, From Fake Dreams, I'm Still Here - all excellent pieces of fanfiction writing (these are just the ones that came to mind in the moment).

To reduce it all down to smut and derivative is not exactly an honest assessment of the medium, and to directly quote your post:

"It’s my belief that cancel culture in literature is in large part due to the growing prevalence of fan fiction community rules in the real world."

I find this statement largely ignores the overall media and cultural landscape we exist in. While there is a LARGE fanfiction community, it is largely divorced from the actual political and publishing industry, though I am aware that there is an overlap of editors and publishers now and previously monitoring these sites for engagement to for an easy "this will sell" author that already has a pre-established community - though this is also not exactly indicative of the role of fanfiction being the cause of writing's decline, and I would posit that it is more illuminating on the nature of the publishing industries capitalistic and LCD approach to writing and reading.

In fact, I can't even say that this is an honest based assessment and that the title and conclusion is hitting on two predominately different points. To quote your blog post again:

"*note: I’ve received many messages since making my jab at fan fiction in my video on romantasy and women’s fiction that insist that smut is not the only kind of fan fiction in existence. I addressed this issue in the current video, the fan fiction video, but to be clear: Smut and explicit content — particularly involving taboo themes like incest or even illegal themes like underage sex and straight-up pedophilia — is so important to fan fiction writers that its protection is 90 percent of the reason AO3 was created in the first place. Moreover, it is one of the most widely talked about “censorship” issues in the community."

Firstly, as you note in your blog post - AO3 was largely created due to the purges that occurred on other sites, predominately Fanfiction Net and its like, and a large majority of the writers who wrote there that were banned and works that were removed migrated over to AO3. It's widely known that AO3's entire brand is built on the inclusion of EVERYTHING - for good or ill. My question is that if you predicated your entire engagement with fanfiction based, from what I have listened to and read, on primarily the immoral and sexual content posted there - then you have not really engaged with Fanfiction - you've engaged with the primary source of not just Smut Fanfiction, but the spaces that actively cater towards it. Then you attribute that, alongside side some general and what I assume are personal biases, to strip the nuance of the discussion around the decline of literature and 'literary fiction' to focus on a largely small role player in the grander space.

I will quote your final paragraph on your blog here too:

"I pose the questions not to start fights, but to start conversations, real conversations. Because fan fiction is ruining not just literature and other storytelling, but also itself. Fan fiction could be wonderful. But it was the first casualty of whatever this thing is that is now infecting the rest of literary culture."

I engage with you thusly - how did you arrive at the conclusion you did that "Fanfiction Has Destroyed Writing (And Everything Else)" - and are you engaging with the concept, or the output of a community within it? Are you engaging with a genuine discourse of the impact it has on writing, as a medium, or on the bits that are now bleeding into the cultural zeitgeist? Because while you are correct- there are absolutely steps needed to be taken in the fanfiction community on the nature of the content produced - but there is a world of difference between THAT and the content itself leading to the decline of readers and literacy and literature and writing ability. That, I think, is a much broader and much more nuanced discussion.

Also note: I am not saying this to be contrarian or defendant - I ask this from a place of genuine curiosity, because the delivery and voice and such feels largely different from your other posts and videos. This largely was written in YouTube comments, but I thought it might be better served posted here, direct and out of the quagmire of the YouTube comments. It just feels more... dismissive? Insulting? Rather indignant and personal - the overall tone and voice. Like a Roman walking into a Celtic camp and calling them all barbarians? At least that is how i heard it - because there is not much of the nuance you'd usually bring, and the entire focus seems to be on the SEXUAL content posted, and not on the medium and nature of fanfiction itself. It just feels different from what you usually post, is all

Also: Yes, Twilight and Fifty Shades were originally fanfiction. Twilight is a bit iffier, as it was largely inspired by My Chemical Romance according to Meyer, and might have originally been drafted as fanfiction of that. Fifty Shades was a fanfic of Twilight.

George Atallah's avatar

Your recent YouTube video was one of the most insightful things I’ve watched in a long time. I came over here because your work deserves far more reach. Please keep going.

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